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[Wikimedia-l] Compare person data
Hoi,
Amir has created functionality that compares data from en.wp de.wp and
it.wp. It is data about "humans" and it only shows differences where they
exist. It compares those four Wikipedias with information in Wikidata.

The idea is that the report will be updated regularly.

The problem we face is: what should it actually look like. Should it just
splatter the info on a page or is more needed. At this time we just have
data [1].

Please help us with something that works easily for now. Once we have
something, it can be prettified and more functional.
Thanks,
GerardM

[1] http://paste.ubuntu.com/8079742/
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
Il 19/ago/2014 09:38 "Gerard Meijssen" <gerard.meijssen@gmail.com> ha
scritto:
>
> Hoi,
> Amir has created functionality that compares data from en.wp de.wp and
> it.wp. It is data about "humans" and it only shows differences where they
> exist. It compares those four Wikipedias with information in Wikidata.

Hi Gerard,

en.wp, de.wp and it.wp are three Wikipedias, so we are missing one :).
Which one is that?

Thanks,

Cristian
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
Hoi,
My bad; four sources, three wikipedia ... I do not think in terms of
Wikipedias I am afraid.
Thanks,
GerardM


On 19 August 2014 09:58, Cristian Consonni <kikkocristian@gmail.com> wrote:

> Il 19/ago/2014 09:38 "Gerard Meijssen" <gerard.meijssen@gmail.com> ha
> scritto:
> >
> > Hoi,
> > Amir has created functionality that compares data from en.wp de.wp and
> > it.wp. It is data about "humans" and it only shows differences where they
> > exist. It compares those four Wikipedias with information in Wikidata.
>
> Hi Gerard,
>
> en.wp, de.wp and it.wp are three Wikipedias, so we are missing one :).
> Which one is that?
>
> Thanks,
>
> Cristian
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
Hi Amir,

2014-08-19 10:38 GMT+02:00 Amir Ladsgroup <ladsgroup@gmail.com>:
> It's three now but the way I designed, it's very easy to extend.

Thanks for this report. I am amazed that over the hundreds of
thousands of Wikipedia biographies[*] it seems that we have only 38
inconsistencies.
Am I understanding your report correctly?

You may want to add some sort of "false positives" list. For example,
for Jimmy Wales in it.wp[1] there's a through explanation about the
uncertainty related to Jimbo's birth date. So I would consider that
being a false positive. A similar situation occurs for Beethoven.

That said I was able to find that Bob Marley's birth date in Wikidata
was incorrectly set to 6 April 1945, when in fact it is indeed 6
February 1945 as en.wp, de.wp, and it.wp where correctly reporting.
(Fixed[2] now!)

Thanks!

Cristian

[*] 265537 in it.wiki: https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categoria:BioBot
[1] https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Wales
[2] https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q409&diff=151644019&oldid=151167823

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
Can we join more Wikipedias to the comparison?


--
Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
http://aharoni.wordpress.com
‪“We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬


2014-08-19 10:38 GMT+03:00 Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen@gmail.com>:

> Hoi,
> Amir has created functionality that compares data from en.wp de.wp and
> it.wp. It is data about "humans" and it only shows differences where they
> exist. It compares those four Wikipedias with information in Wikidata.
>
> The idea is that the report will be updated regularly.
>
> The problem we face is: what should it actually look like. Should it just
> splatter the info on a page or is more needed. At this time we just have
> data [1].
>
> Please help us with something that works easily for now. Once we have
> something, it can be prettified and more functional.
> Thanks,
> GerardM
>
> [1] http://paste.ubuntu.com/8079742/
> _______________________________________________
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
Pretty sure those are just the :first: 38... Note the q numbers. (They are ascending and don't make to q5000.)

That suggests the full list will be very large indeed.

Joe

www.joedecker.net

> On Aug 19, 2014, at 2:49, Cristian Consonni <kikkocristian@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Hi Amir,
>
> 2014-08-19 10:38 GMT+02:00 Amir Ladsgroup <ladsgroup@gmail.com>:
>> It's three now but the way I designed, it's very easy to extend.
>
> Thanks for this report. I am amazed that over the hundreds of
> thousands of Wikipedia biographies[*] it seems that we have only 38
> inconsistencies.
> Am I understanding your report correctly?
>
> You may want to add some sort of "false positives" list. For example,
> for Jimmy Wales in it.wp[1] there's a through explanation about the
> uncertainty related to Jimbo's birth date. So I would consider that
> being a false positive. A similar situation occurs for Beethoven.
>
> That said I was able to find that Bob Marley's birth date in Wikidata
> was incorrectly set to 6 April 1945, when in fact it is indeed 6
> February 1945 as en.wp, de.wp, and it.wp where correctly reporting.
> (Fixed[2] now!)
>
> Thanks!
>
> Cristian
>
> [*] 265537 in it.wiki: https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categoria:BioBot
> [1] https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Wales
> [2] https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q409&diff=151644019&oldid=151167823
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
HoI,
You are absolutely right.. What is needed is a report that looks good
enough for now and a public ie visible place to put it.
Thanks,
GerardM


On 19 August 2014 12:13, Joe Decker <joedecker@gmail.com> wrote:

> Pretty sure those are just the :first: 38... Note the q numbers. (They
> are ascending and don't make to q5000.)
>
> That suggests the full list will be very large indeed.
>
> Joe
>
> www.joedecker.net
>
> > On Aug 19, 2014, at 2:49, Cristian Consonni <kikkocristian@gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Amir,
> >
> > 2014-08-19 10:38 GMT+02:00 Amir Ladsgroup <ladsgroup@gmail.com>:
> >> It's three now but the way I designed, it's very easy to extend.
> >
> > Thanks for this report. I am amazed that over the hundreds of
> > thousands of Wikipedia biographies[*] it seems that we have only 38
> > inconsistencies.
> > Am I understanding your report correctly?
> >
> > You may want to add some sort of "false positives" list. For example,
> > for Jimmy Wales in it.wp[1] there's a through explanation about the
> > uncertainty related to Jimbo's birth date. So I would consider that
> > being a false positive. A similar situation occurs for Beethoven.
> >
> > That said I was able to find that Bob Marley's birth date in Wikidata
> > was incorrectly set to 6 April 1945, when in fact it is indeed 6
> > February 1945 as en.wp, de.wp, and it.wp where correctly reporting.
> > (Fixed[2] now!)
> >
> > Thanks!
> >
> > Cristian
> >
> > [*] 265537 in it.wiki: https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categoria:BioBot
> > [1] https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Wales
> > [2]
> https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q409&diff=151644019&oldid=151167823
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
IMHO a simple table, maybe even a wikitable, would suffice for the initial
iteration. We can get much more fancy later.

Of course, if Infoboxes/Persondata on these Wikipedias were to use some Lua
magic, biographies with e.g. mismatching birthdates could automatically be
added to a maintenance category...

Cheers,
Magnus


On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 11:18 AM, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
> wrote:

> HoI,
> You are absolutely right.. What is needed is a report that looks good
> enough for now and a public ie visible place to put it.
> Thanks,
> GerardM
>
>
> On 19 August 2014 12:13, Joe Decker <joedecker@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Pretty sure those are just the :first: 38... Note the q numbers. (They
> > are ascending and don't make to q5000.)
> >
> > That suggests the full list will be very large indeed.
> >
> > Joe
> >
> > www.joedecker.net
> >
> > > On Aug 19, 2014, at 2:49, Cristian Consonni <kikkocristian@gmail.com>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi Amir,
> > >
> > > 2014-08-19 10:38 GMT+02:00 Amir Ladsgroup <ladsgroup@gmail.com>:
> > >> It's three now but the way I designed, it's very easy to extend.
> > >
> > > Thanks for this report. I am amazed that over the hundreds of
> > > thousands of Wikipedia biographies[*] it seems that we have only 38
> > > inconsistencies.
> > > Am I understanding your report correctly?
> > >
> > > You may want to add some sort of "false positives" list. For example,
> > > for Jimmy Wales in it.wp[1] there's a through explanation about the
> > > uncertainty related to Jimbo's birth date. So I would consider that
> > > being a false positive. A similar situation occurs for Beethoven.
> > >
> > > That said I was able to find that Bob Marley's birth date in Wikidata
> > > was incorrectly set to 6 April 1945, when in fact it is indeed 6
> > > February 1945 as en.wp, de.wp, and it.wp where correctly reporting.
> > > (Fixed[2] now!)
> > >
> > > Thanks!
> > >
> > > Cristian
> > >
> > > [*] 265537 in it.wiki: https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categoria:BioBot
> > > [1] https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Wales
> > > [2]
> >
> https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q409&diff=151644019&oldid=151167823
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
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> >
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> >
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
Hi,

2014-08-19 12:13 GMT+02:00 Joe Decker <joedecker@gmail.com>:
> Pretty sure those are just the :first: 38... Note the q numbers. (They
are ascending and don't make to q5000.)
>
> That suggests the full list will be very large indeed.

This makes a lot of sense. Thanks.

Il 19/ago/2014 12:19 "Gerard Meijssen" <gerard.meijssen@gmail.com> ha
scritto:
> You are absolutely right.. What is needed is a report that looks good
> enough for now and a public ie visible place to put it.

A project page on Wikidata with links/redirects from relevant local wikis
project pages?

C
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
Sorry to digress into minutiae, but as a note. The maintenance category idea may have a subtle flaw, I suspect wikidata data updates won't update said maintenance category until the corresponding Wikipedia page is purged/rerendered.

--Joe

www.joedecker.net

> On Aug 19, 2014, at 3:41, Magnus Manske <magnusmanske@googlemail.com> wrote:
>
> IMHO a simple table, maybe even a wikitable, would suffice for the initial
> iteration. We can get much more fancy later.
>
> Of course, if Infoboxes/Persondata on these Wikipedias were to use some Lua
> magic, biographies with e.g. mismatching birthdates could automatically be
> added to a maintenance category...
>
> Cheers,
> Magnus
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 11:18 AM, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijssen@gmail.com
>> wrote:
>
>> HoI,
>> You are absolutely right.. What is needed is a report that looks good
>> enough for now and a public ie visible place to put it.
>> Thanks,
>> GerardM
>>
>>
>>> On 19 August 2014 12:13, Joe Decker <joedecker@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> Pretty sure those are just the :first: 38... Note the q numbers. (They
>>> are ascending and don't make to q5000.)
>>>
>>> That suggests the full list will be very large indeed.
>>>
>>> Joe
>>>
>>> www.joedecker.net
>>>
>>>>> On Aug 19, 2014, at 2:49, Cristian Consonni <kikkocristian@gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Hi Amir,
>>>>
>>>> 2014-08-19 10:38 GMT+02:00 Amir Ladsgroup <ladsgroup@gmail.com>:
>>>>> It's three now but the way I designed, it's very easy to extend.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for this report. I am amazed that over the hundreds of
>>>> thousands of Wikipedia biographies[*] it seems that we have only 38
>>>> inconsistencies.
>>>> Am I understanding your report correctly?
>>>>
>>>> You may want to add some sort of "false positives" list. For example,
>>>> for Jimmy Wales in it.wp[1] there's a through explanation about the
>>>> uncertainty related to Jimbo's birth date. So I would consider that
>>>> being a false positive. A similar situation occurs for Beethoven.
>>>>
>>>> That said I was able to find that Bob Marley's birth date in Wikidata
>>>> was incorrectly set to 6 April 1945, when in fact it is indeed 6
>>>> February 1945 as en.wp, de.wp, and it.wp where correctly reporting.
>>>> (Fixed[2] now!)
>>>>
>>>> Thanks!
>>>>
>>>> Cristian
>>>>
>>>> [*] 265537 in it.wiki: https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categoria:BioBot
>>>> [1] https://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jimmy_Wales
>>>> [2]
>> https://www.wikidata.org/w/index.php?title=Q409&diff=151644019&oldid=151167823
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
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>>>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>What is needed is a report that looks good enough for now and a public ie
>visible place to put it.

Neat idea!

There's <https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Database_reports>, of
course. In my experience, users don't really care what the report is
titled or how it looks; they're much more concerned with accurate and
up-to-date (read: actionable) report data.

One of the benefits of using a wiki page is that wiki pages have pre-built
notification structures (watchlists, RSS feeds, IRC feed, and e-mail).

To this end, depending on who the relevant audience is of this report,
updating multiple pages on local wikis may be a lot more fruitful.

MZMcBride



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
On Tue, Aug 19, 2014 at 12:41 PM, Magnus Manske <magnusmanske@googlemail.com
> wrote:

> Of course, if Infoboxes/Persondata on these Wikipedias were to use some Lua
> magic, biographies with e.g. mismatching birthdates could automatically be
> added to a maintenance category...
>

We already do that for various infoboxes using Wikidata on cswiki. See
categories under
https://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kategorie:%C3%9Adr%C5%BEba:Wikidata – e.g.
https://cs.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kategorie:%C3%9Adr%C5%BEba:OSM_relace_r%C5%AFzn%C3%A1_od_Wikidat
lists articles linking to OpenStreetMap with a different OSM relation ID
than listed in Wikidata.

-- [[cs:User:Mormegil | Petr Kadlec]]
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
re the birth anomalies, we have been running a process for several years now that looks for people alive according to certain wikipedias and dead according to up to 80 others. The format works well and has been broadened to various other anomalies such as being dead but not born.

https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Death_anomalies_table

The key thing to remember is that when Wikipedias differ you need reliable source to settle the difference.

Wikidata may or may not make this sort of thing easier, but my suspicion is that resolving anomalies will improve Wikidata as well as Wikipedia.

Regards

Jonathan (WereSpielChequers)



> On 19 Aug 2014, at 22:05, wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org wrote
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2014 09:04:17 -0400
> From: MZMcBride <z@mzmcbride.com>
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List <wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org>
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data
> Message-ID: <D018C23A.422B5%z@mzmcbride.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
>
> Gerard Meijssen wrote:
>> What is needed is a report that looks good enough for now and a public ie
>> visible place to put it.
>
> Neat idea!
>
> There's <https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Database_reports>, of
> course. In my experience, users don't really care what the report is
> titled or how it looks; they're much more concerned with accurate and
> up-to-date (read: actionable) report data.
>
> One of the benefits of using a wiki page is that wiki pages have pre-built
> notification structures (watchlists, RSS feeds, IRC feed, and e-mail).
>
> To this end, depending on who the relevant audience is of this report,
> updating multiple pages on local wikis may be a lot more fruitful.
>
> MZMcBride
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data [ In reply to ]
Hoi,
There is another benefit, when Wikidata is KNOWN to have good data as it is
actively comparing its data with other sources, people will get more
confidence in the quality of Wikidata.
Thanks,
Gerard


On 21 August 2014 16:26, WereSpielChequers <werespielchequers@gmail.com>
wrote:

> re the birth anomalies, we have been running a process for several years
> now that looks for people alive according to certain wikipedias and dead
> according to up to 80 others. The format works well and has been broadened
> to various other anomalies such as being dead but not born.
>
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Death_anomalies_table
>
> The key thing to remember is that when Wikipedias differ you need reliable
> source to settle the difference.
>
> Wikidata may or may not make this sort of thing easier, but my suspicion
> is that resolving anomalies will improve Wikidata as well as Wikipedia.
>
> Regards
>
> Jonathan (WereSpielChequers)
>
>
>
> > On 19 Aug 2014, at 22:05, wikimedia-l-request@lists.wikimedia.org wrote
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Tue, 19 Aug 2014 09:04:17 -0400
> > From: MZMcBride <z@mzmcbride.com>
> > To: Wikimedia Mailing List <wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org>
> > Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] Compare person data
> > Message-ID: <D018C23A.422B5%z@mzmcbride.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
> >
> > Gerard Meijssen wrote:
> >> What is needed is a report that looks good enough for now and a public
> ie
> >> visible place to put it.
> >
> > Neat idea!
> >
> > There's <https://www.wikidata.org/wiki/Wikidata:Database_reports>, of
> > course. In my experience, users don't really care what the report is
> > titled or how it looks; they're much more concerned with accurate and
> > up-to-date (read: actionable) report data.
> >
> > One of the benefits of using a wiki page is that wiki pages have
> pre-built
> > notification structures (watchlists, RSS feeds, IRC feed, and e-mail).
> >
> > To this end, depending on who the relevant audience is of this report,
> > updating multiple pages on local wikis may be a lot more fruitful.
> >
> > MZMcBride
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